You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!
PLEASE NOTE: Do NOT use an optonline.net email address when you register, as you will not receive your activation email. Why? Because CABLEVISION AND THE DOLANS SUCK.
If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.
im not sure if this should be here or in the radio forum, feel free to move it if you like.
My question is what is the big deal with switching to plain language all of a sudden. I/M/O the radio codes have worked fine for years now its being changed? Any thoughts?
Clearly the push for plain english is driven by the possibility of large scale events with people from various parts of the state or even country needing to be on the same page.
As someone that has worked in both environments (codes & plain english), plain english makes more sense. When using standardized terminology plain english is as short and often shorter on the radio: "en-route" vs "Twen-ty-one". Also, when hopping boarders for m/a different codes/signals can cause confusion.
When I first went from a 10-code system to plain english I didn't like it. But now, I honestly dont see any benefit to a code/signal system. Some argue that we need to be "secret" so the public doesn't hear every little detail about an incident. Well, most people who listen to scanners are in the business or already know what the codes are, (you can look them up anyway)
The 'Plain Language' push has come from the feds so that interoperability is more easily attained during large scale, multi-agency events. Does it make sense? Sure, I can see it.
Look at NCPD. They use both plain language as well as radio codes. Why? I'm not sure. But it seems to work. Can any of the NCPD brothers/sisters here advise further?
But let's face it. There are just two many X-factors and too much terminology which is agency-specific within departments. Cops need to know what certain things are, firefighters must be well versed in other things, EMS even more terms and conditions. Codes, wheter you like them or not, can help clear some of that up and shorten radio transmissions.
But now look at Nassau FD's. 71 departments, 71 sets of codes. Some departments use signal 61, others use 'code red' for cardiac arrests. Some say 'general alarm' while others use 'structure fire' when alerting for an automatic alarm. It should be one standard code list that is adhered to by ALL departments. This should be for all radio transmissions all well as initial alerts. If it's an aided case, say that. If it's an automatic alarm, say that. (P.S.--Let's not even get into Hempstead FD and their codes...HAHAHAHAHA!)
Personally, I'd like to see a UNIFORM radio transmission list with a mix of both code and plain language that at least ALL FDs use here in Nassau. Saying 'enroute,' 'on scene,' 'read direct' makes sense to me. But I think there should be some codes for certain conditions for both the ease of radio use and sensitivity of condition. Would you rather say '25 HM' or 'request Nassau County Fire Marshall Haz Mat team to the scene?' Further, do you want the undesirable buffs (the press, perps, etc.) knowing that you have a DOA or an EDP on your hands? Wouldn't you rather notify your dispatcher of a '10-62' or similar code?
Signals and codes are good and are still good for the battalion frequency. However the fireground is different. Unit and positions to identify who's who is good and should be used most of the time. However there is also a need for not only plain language, sometimes less formality in certain situations. Be it at a mutual aid incident, someone from your department might be operating in proximity to the host department's hose line and just need a "hand." So why not ask for it? Formal/uniform is good, but like everything, it has its place.
Further, do you want the undesirable buffs (the press, perps, etc.) knowing that you have a DOA or an EDP on your hands? Wouldn't you rather notify your dispatcher of a '10-62' or similar code?
If these people are listening to a scanner, they already know the codes...or can look them up.
There really isn't anything that can't be said in plain english. At first I didn't think so, but after 10 years in a couple of plain english systems, it was hard to come back to the NC signal codes.
when will nassau and suffolk get on the same page w/ 10 codes
i hate to agree w/ sig 12 but get on the same page w/ 10 codes while responding and on fireground keep things short sweet to the point and plain language.......
it really looks pretty foolish that nassau and suffolk arent even on the same page
One thing I will say, in Suffolk the signals work well. But some depts now use plain language & some do a mix (FRES included) and it sounds like crap. Everyone got scared by thinking they'd get no Fed Grant money if they didn't use plain language and the NIMS BS.
Atleast Suffolk didn't "stray" with the signals as much as Nassau did (Hempstead!!). Why all these FD's would want 100 different meanings for signals is beyond me - the depts dropped the ball on that one. Look at signal 98, it varies from dist to dist.
My thing is this, when working in your own dist use signals (it sounds alot more professional) or use plain langauge if you like. But when you're operating in a M/A situation or large scale incident - stick to the plain langauge. I don't know what 641 is, but if you say Merrick Engine 1....ahhh ok!!! or we can be city buffs like Bethpage and say "SQUAD"!!!!! LOL
im thinking newsday had something to do with it...i just dont see why its being pushed to plain language when a few signals are being mixed in a blender and spat out in different departments (hempstead)...i think we can get rid of half the signals and then some....plain language dosent sound professional on the air to be honest "00 989 is 21" not "00 989 responding"
Hempstead has been around for 175 yrs. and self dispatches. thats probably why their codes are a little different. I'm guessing they were around before Firecom. But Hempstead is basically plain language except for 10(phone call) 13/14(units up) 17(PD) and 24/25(Inline pumping). seems to work very good.
its working fine in 300 but i have to admit i get mixed up once and awhile but it is hard to use plain language in 300 signals for the 15 for 310 320 340 and 350 and then the 10 code at the town so 1 unified system for all would be a good thing
I've worked with both. Even with plain text, you need a few codes or pro-words. For example, it is easier to say 'respond Code Yellow' 'on the quiet' or 'signal 12' instead of saying 'respond without lights and siren obeying all traffic laws.' 'Signal 13' is easier than 'units assignment complete and returning to quarters.'
Signal 10, second alarm, etc are useful when they put a set dispatch procedure into place. Ironically, with all the signals out there, NC has been slow to implement set mutual aid/additional alarm procedures. Think of how much easier it is to say 'transmit a second alarm' than to say 'mutual aid 1 ladder/1 engine from X to the scene, 1 engine from Y to HQ, 1 ladder/1 ambulance from Z to HQ' etc.
Plain language on the air is a result of the push for all departments to become NIMS compliant.
Hempstead has been using plain language forever..."80, on the way"..."80 on scene"....."80, working fire"....and the point gets across. I listen to certain depts "Dispatch 'x', unit xxxx is 21 captain, M4 code 1". Sounds lengthy, but good info is being given here. It's not 100% plain english but again, the point gets across.
Codes are confuisng. I once had a partner who was a city cop, worked per diem doing city EMS for a hospital based unit, and did per diem work as a CC in Suffolk. This poor bastard had to remember THREE sets of radio codes...
just a fue weeks back i was lisening to a 9 battalion company at a car turned over in the 3 pecint the furst unit on the scene said whatever giberish in plane languge and his own cumpany culdnt understand him its time to for depatments to hafe bases for members on radioes
Plain language on the air is a result of the push for all departments to become NIMS compliant.
Hempstead has been using plain language forever..."80, on the way"..."80 on scene"....."80, working fire"....and the point gets across. I listen to certain depts "Dispatch 'x', unit xxxx is 21 captain, M4 code 1". Sounds lengthy, but good info is being given here. It's not 100% plain english but again, the point gets across.
Codes are confuisng. I once had a partner who was a city cop, worked per diem doing city EMS for a hospital based unit, and did per diem work as a CC in Suffolk. This poor bastard had to remember THREE sets of radio codes...
Hempstead uses codes as well plain language and it works for them - signal 17 on scene reports working fire, signal 24 to hose 2, any chief signal 10, all units signal 14 ect... So lets not get carried away with ourselves here. The use of codes and or plain language is only as good as those who are at each end of the mic. You keep it simple and get your point and message across so you and your companies/units can have there mission or task at hand get accomplished...
Plain Language on the air.
