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At a high level, I understand that PD uses a repeated radio system and has point to point capability as well. They use the same system for 21/22 and operations. They have lots of subscribers using the same system for multiple calls concurrently. Their communications can be life or death.
how is that different from fire service communications?
Right off the bat.................
All of NCPD's calls are dispatched through one centralized place.
FD gets dispatched by any number of different places.
All of NCPD's radio codes etc. are standardized. A 10-72 is the same thing in bayville as it is in Atlantic Beach.
The point to point or "direct" frequency is so rarely used. Most of the cops using the radios I would be willing to bet have very little idea of the difference between a repeated frequency and a direct one.
I know it's not a perfect system but it works and has done so for years. It could use some upgrading and more frequencies. That is one issue that the new system is supposed to address. We'll see.
I agree, the radios for the fire service in the county should work as well as the PD, there shouldn't be any difference.
Flat out- When NCPD switched to the UHF Freqs (and installed MANY repeaters) probably in the late 70's-early 80's?? They did their homework...
...Without "telling" where there repeaters are, they are plentiful and quite frankly work quite well. Very few "dead" areas (2422 correct me if I'm wrong)
I can hear a 7th Pct cop in Massapequa in Westchester crystal clear. (Car scanner through the regular car antenna). Cant hear anyone outside the 1st, 2nd, 3rd or 4th FD Battalions without a 45' base scanner antenna outside at home.
As far as hearing the system, the dead spots depend on where you are. The north shore is tough. As far as talking into the system on a portable radio, the same rule applies. The system was installed in 1982 and uses four transmitter locations, but any given channel only uses one transmit site at a time. When the system was designed and installed, it was good. Going forward, it does not provide the in-building coverage, redundancy, or capacity that will be needed.
Though, I agree that some channels are easy to hear at a distance (the 4th & 5th precincts for sure). Others are a little rough (Tac 10).
I think when the new system is online, it will do a great job. Hopefully this one will hold on just a little longer...
As far as hearing the system, the dead spots depend on where you are. The north shore is tough. As far as talking into the system on a portable radio, the same rule applies. The system was installed in 1982 and uses four transmitter locations, but any given channel only uses one transmit site at a time. When the system was designed and installed, it was good. Going forward, it does not provide the in-building coverage, redundancy, or capacity that will be needed.
Though, I agree that some channels are easy to hear at a distance (the 4th & 5th precincts for sure). Others are a little rough (Tac 10).
I think when the new system is online, it will do a great job. Hopefully this one will hold on just a little longer...
clorox, do you mean back in 82, the system had 4 transmitters?, because ncpd uses more repeaters than that
Most communications take place through CB, car to car is generally on F10. If you want to see something that might compare to fireground it happens at scenes such as barricades etc. You will find BSO on their own freq which is not repeated. They operate outside of the regular channels and all communications are monitored inside the command post. For the most part, the patrol cops stay on either the command frequency or switch to channel 2. ESU operates on Freq 8, but we also have to share that with Hwy. At a barricade scene it can be annoying.
getting back to my original query, why is repeated "fireground" okay for PD, but not for FD?
LOL...2422 summed it up good, but here's another answer....
PD has MDT's.... granted, there is still radio traffic, but no Nassau FD is using MDT's -YET... they WILL be functioning soon....
...On another note you have a little bit more radio discipline with NCPD-
.... TYPICALLY the PRIMARY post car will be the only one transmitting, again, typically. Or, a Boss (the "40's")... If you were to repeat a FG frequency, you would now have every member with an HT clogging a repeater with their transmissions.... some places have repeatered FG's, which works fine for them, but point-to-point at a fire is TYPICALLY better.
It boils down to Radio Discipline. Some places enforce it, some places dont.
You dont need a repeater to receive a "mayday"... anyone near by (usually within 100 ft) will hear it and act appropriately. Glen Cove aint gonna pull my ass outta a basement in Malverne.
My best guess is that fire calls usually involve several or many members at one place at one time. Police calls usually involve only one or two members at a time. Most PD assignments (I am guessing) do not have so many people to require a command post. Also, law enforcement operations look inherently mobile. For example, except for crime scenes, cars evade stopping, people might run, etc. Fire assignments tend to stay put.
getting back to my original query, why is repeated "fireground" okay for PD, but not for FD?
As a radio listener (yah, ok BUFF), I would like to know why more Departments aren't setup for repeated Fireground.
I know the argument about...well, if someone steps on you.. or if you can't hit the repeater..
I'm not talking about Repeating a fireground in the way most of you are thinking.
I'm talking about the way Massapequa has their fireground freq setup.
Everyone using the Fireground frequency talks and listens on the Repeater Input. Making all fireground operations SIMPLEX....but, that "Talk-Around" or Simplex frequency is actually an input to the Fireground Repeater.
The Repeater Output is really only strong enough to hear just outside their district, but it still is a nice radio setup.
Think about it, anyone that isn't on scene (hmm dispatcher??) can keep track as to what is actually unfolding at the fire scene... And as a "BUFF" its great listening
And even if I don't understand the system, at least I tried to bring the thread back on track lol
As a radio listener (yah, ok BUFF), I would like to know why more Departments aren't setup for repeated Fireground.
I know the argument about...well, if someone steps on you.. or if you can't hit the repeater..
I'm not talking about Repeating a fireground in the way most of you are thinking.
I'm talking about the way Massapequa has their fireground freq setup.
Everyone using the Fireground frequency talks and listens on the Repeater Input. Making all fireground operations SIMPLEX....but, that "Talk-Around" or Simplex frequency is actually an input to the Fireground Repeater.
The Repeater Output is really only strong enough to hear just outside their district, but it still is a nice radio setup.
Think about it, anyone that isn't on scene (hmm dispatcher??) can keep track as to what is actually unfolding at the fire scene... And as a "BUFF" its great listening
And even if I don't understand the system, at least I tried to bring the thread back on track lol
That actually sounds like a great setup!
a simplex
yet repeated
fireground channel
which is smart, because if the dispatcher happens to hear a mayday
he can notify people of it on the main frequency as well
Quote:
Originally Posted by w2lie
Why not.... its public info....
Just do an FCC Search, and you can find all the locations.
IT'S PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE ANYWAY VIA OUR FRIENDS @ THE FCC!!!
That is quite true. The licenses list the longitude and latitude of the various transmitter sites. An enterprising site operator has merged that information with Google Maps and created the following reports:
The Firecom link http://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?cs=KEG254 only returns Mineola so I guess the various remotes such as Sea Cliff and East Norwich are not individually listed. Medcom does not show NUMC so I wonder if they are listing remote receivers. Then again, nobody ever said the license records were 100% accurate.
PD Radio System vs FD
Linear Mode
